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INTRODUCTION- PLEASE READ FIRST TO UNDERSTAND THIS FORUM!

"This Harbeth User Group (HUG) is the Manufacturer's own managed forum dedicated to natural sound, realisable by controlling the confounding variables between tthe microphone and the listeners' ears.

For example, the design of and interaction between the hifi amplifier and its speaker load can and potentially will alter the sound balance of what you hear. To reproduce the sounds captured by the recording microphones, as Harbeth speakers are designed to do, you would naturally select system components (sources, electronics, cables and so on) that do not color the sound before it reaches the speakers.

Identifying components for their system neutrality should, logically, start with the interpretation and analysis of their technical, objective performance, as any and every deviation from a measurably flat frequency response at any point along the serial chain from microphone to ear is very likely to cause the total system to have an audible sonic personality. That includes the contribution of the listening room itself.

HUG specialises in making complex technical matters simple to understand, aiding the identification of audio components likely to maintain a faithful relationship between the recorded sound and the sound you hear. With our heritage of natural sound, HUG cannot be really be expected to guide in the selection, approval, endorsement or even discussion of equipment that is intend to introduce a significantly personalised sound to the audio signal chain. For that you should do your own research and above all, make the effort to visit an Authorised Dealer and listen to your music at your loudness on your loudspeakers through the various electronics offered there. There is no on-line substitute for that time investment in a dealer's showroom.

If you desire to intentionally tune your system sound to your personal taste, please consider carefully how much you should rely upon the subjective opinions of strangers. Their hearing acuity and taste will be different to yours, as will be their motives and budget, their listening distance, listening loudness and listening room treatment, not necessarily leading to appropriate equipment selection and listening satisfaction for you.

Alternatively, if faithfully reproducing the sound intended by the composer, score, conductor and musicians over your speakers is your audio dream, then understanding something of the issues likely to fulfill that objective is what this forum has been helping with since 2006. Welcome!"


Jan. 2018
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Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

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  • #31
    Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Originally posted by A.S.
    Future Harbeths will (probably) revert to a single pair, reducing assembly time, cost and contact resistance.
    Alan, I know you will probably recommend against the consumer opening up his speakers but you were the one that brought up contact resistance. So when not bi-wiring, couldn't we eliminate the whole jumper issue by moving the internal crossover wires from the top terminals to the lower terminals and then use only the lower terminals without the jumpers?

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

      I think both speaker cable and interconnect cable definitely "alter" the sound of your system, but often not in a positive way. I've tried a number of different stuff and it is always better to buy the cable and interconnects from the same company. What is needed is something that doesn't exaggerate one aspect of the sound over another and basically lets the amp control the speakers.
      There's nowt wrong with QED 79 strand. It sounds together.
      I am using some nordost speaker cable, not so expensive - 11 quid a metre and that's the best i've found at an affordable price. Unfortunately it's not really advertised much and i can't remember the name, and everything else nordost is expensive. It's bi-wire cable and gives a balanced, detailed sound. Otherwise i'd run scared and revert to 79 strand (i kept 6 metres on standby) because a lot of the budget stuff just exaggerates one aspect of the sound and sacrifices other aspects. I guess if you go expensive an audition at home is in order, or you really do risk wasting your cash. A few crates of beer would be a more worthwhile investment unless you can take the cables home and try them first.
      Happy listening.

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      • #33
        Re: Stay with Copper!

        Originally posted by Frihed89
        I have also had good success with Kimber copper ICs and speaker cables between all components. Then I tried Audio Note Lexus ICs and speaker cables and got warmth + more detail and less "air". I bought them. Then I auditioned Audience AU 24 equipment. Out of this world, but I can't afford them. As good as the Lexus' are , the AU's are remarkable: just the right combination of warmth and detail.

        If you try the AUs or even the Lexus', you may forget any plans you ever had to get silver cables.
        Hello Frihed89, Just tried the Audio Note AN-L in my C&ES3 system with impreesive result. On reading your feedback on the Lexus, I'm tempted to get the Lexus instead. have you auditioned the AN-L against the Lexus? Lexus cost a lot more, but is the difference substantial?

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        • #34
          Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

          Now I am using Lexus speaker cables and IC with M30, happy with them, but never tried LA against Lexus.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

            Originally posted by Hu
            Now I am using Lexus speaker cables and IC with M30, happy with them, but never tried LA against Lexus.
            Hello Hu,

            Thanks for your response.

            I wasn't expecting the obvious positive effect of the AN-L speaker cable in my system. I'm using quite generic OFC cables which sounded just fine before the AN-L brought in a wealth of inner details, slightly improved bass impact and depth - in a natural & coherent manner.

            I'm curious what the higher end Lexus can do but the price for a 2.5m pair is US$590 here - drastically more than the AL-N

            Are the Audio Note & Harbeth popularly matched with each other?

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            • #36
              Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

              Originally posted by Naimeo
              Hello Hu,


              Are the Audio Note & Harbeth popularly matched with each other?
              Hello Naimeo,

              Sorry, I really do not know if the AN and Harbeth are popular match. Just make my system sounds more vivid, prettier treble and more musical than Analysis Oval 9 with my system. I have never tried AN-L.

              Hu

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Stay with Copper!

                Originally posted by Frihed89
                I have also had good success with Kimber copper ICs and speaker cables between all components. Then I tried Audio Note Lexus ICs and speaker cables and got warmth + more detail and less "air". I bought them. Then I auditioned Audience AU 24 equipment. Out of this world, but I can't afford them. As good as the Lexus' are , the AU's are remarkable: just the right combination of warmth and detail.

                If you try the AUs or even the Lexus', you may forget any plans you ever had to get silver cables.
                John McDonald from Audience said that anyone who can not afford the Au24 should definately try the Audience Maestro or Conductor cables. They are balanced the same as Au24; just not quite as resolute. They are great.

                Hu

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                • #38
                  Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                  Originally posted by Hu
                  Hello Naimeo,

                  Sorry, I really do not know if the AN and Harbeth are popular match. Just make my system sounds more vivid, prettier treble and more musical than Analysis Oval 9 with my system. I have never tried AN-L.

                  Hu
                  I've just bought a set of Lexus speaker cables. Neutal, natural & open sound. Looking for interconnect now and auitioning a set of Goertz Silver Micro Purl - tonally quite balanced but just a tad bright with great imaging, soundstaging and microdynamics.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                    Hi,

                    Any Kondo silver speaker cable user here?
                    It seems like most Harbeth users are using copper speaker cable. Silver speaker cable users, care to contribute?

                    I'd listened to a setup, using full Kondo cables, smooth, sweet, not bright at all and emotions. But not using Harbeth speakers.

                    Later..

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                      I settled on Cardas Twinlink speaker cable (with integral Cardas jumpers) and a Cardas Microtwin interconnect after I migrated from Naim to a Leben tubed integrated amplifier.

                      With Naim you inevitably use their cabling (though it isn't entirely necessary). So I had to start over with cabling. I demo'd a variety of relatively inexpensive cables before settling on Cardas. There's something to be said for the litz construction that Cardas uses, I must conclude.

                      Integral jumpers are where you solder / crimp the jumpers directly into the spade or banana plug at the speaker end of the speaker cable. It's an old Naim-advocated trick and is probably the best method for jumping bi-wire terminals.

                      Of the several speakers I've owned over the years, aftermarket jumpers or bi-wiring (internal or external) has ALWAYS been significantly better than the stock brass jumper plates to my ears -- regardless of whether bi-wiring is an improvement in itself with a given pair of speakers.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                        Hi Greg

                        I am a BIG Cardas fan. I use GR Interconnects, NR speaker cable and Golden power cords with my Monitor 30's. I also use Microtwin IC's with my tape deck to good effect. Twinlink speaker cable did not work well in my room. Too much mid bass with Twinlink speaker cable. Because of the concrete construction of my room, it tends to hold on to mid bass, so it was not a good fit. This was before I had Harbeth speakers. I wonder how the Twinlink would work with Harbeth?

                        Jay

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                        • #42
                          Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                          Here is a link to an excellent doc about the technologie behind speaker cables.

                          http://www.qed.co.uk/downloads/qed/b...s/genreprt.pdf

                          Very helpful to understand what's going on ...

                          Thomas

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                          • #43
                            Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                            I worry that all these fancy cables mentioned, especially the capacitive Kimber designs, will alter the tonal balance of the speakers quite noticably (and measurably)...

                            Had AS used a fancy cable "with character" in the speakers' development, then your findings in this thread may have been completely different.

                            If 79 strand isn't available outside of the UK, then how about 6A stranded mains cable, which many professionals use (unless I am mistaken). I used it for a while in 4 - 5m runs and had no problem at all. The only thing against it may be the quality/purity of the copper (I used a BICC variant) as suppliers like QED may specify a better quality copper (Cable Talk in the UK did as I recall).

                            Just an opinion...

                            I'd also say that my HL5's were pretty well immune to the Bi-Wire fad and didn't sound much, if any different to me when used this way. (I always told people that 50% of the "improvement" was increased dealer profit in the extra cable sold, 30% the amp seeing a different load and 20% any audible results from the previous 30%.....)

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                              I think i have previously posted about cables, but would like to change my stance. I recently took all the (moderately) expensive cables out of my system and put basic interconnects, mains cables in. I then sat down and listened to several recordings i know very well. I know the parts of each recording which impress me, and i know when i'm listening to a sound i enjoy. I have to say, there was no difference at all between a 200 quid mains lead and a basic one, a 100 quid interconnect and a 5 quid one. I think it is all the placebo effect, and am willing to admit that i have been a victim. I left the cables in place and found that the musical satisfaction i get from listening to my Harbeths is exactly as it was before. Spend your money on components, reposition your speakers, improve your acoustics! I am still listening happily without expensive cables and won't be going back. My ears haven't changed, but my grip on audible reality has.

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                              • #45
                                Re: Cables for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

                                How refreshing to read your post, Holden! The placebo effect is far better understood in the medical/scientific fields than it is in audio. I think your observatons are right on the mark. Thanks for expressing them.

                                Ned

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