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HUG - here for all audio enthusiasts

The Harbeth User Group is the primary channel for public communication with Harbeth's HQ. If you have a 'scientific mind' and are curious about how the ear works, how it can lead us to make the right - and wrong - audio equipment decisions, and about the technical ins and outs of audio equipment, how it's designed and what choices the designer makes, then the factual Science of Audio sub-forum area of HUG is your place. The objective methods of comparing audio equipment under controlled conditions has been thoroughly examined here on HUG and elsewhere and should be accessible to non-experts and able to be tried-out at home without deep technical knowledge. From a design perspective, today's award winning Harbeths could not have been designed any other way.

Alternatively, if you just like chatting about audio and subjectivity rules for you, then the Subjective Soundings area is you. If you are quite set in your subjectivity, then HUG is likely to be a bit too fact based for you, as many of the contributors have maximised their pleasure in home music reproduction by allowing their head to rule their heart. If upon examination we think that Posts are better suited to one sub-forum than than the other, they will be redirected during Moderation, which is applied throughout the site.

Questions and Posts about, for example, 'does amplifier A sounds better than amplifier B' or 'which speaker stands or cables are best' are suitable for the Subjective Soundings area only, although HUG is really not the best place to have these sort of purely subjective airings.

The Moderators' decision is final in all matters and Harbeth does not necessarily agree with the contents of any member contributions, especially in the Subjective Soundings area, and has no control over external content.

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{Updated Oct. 2017}
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New model ?

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  • New model ?

    A missive from Harbeth HQ referring to a NEW model.

    Any clues? Has Alan finally got round to designing the Harbeth turntable?

  • #2
    Originally posted by ssfas View Post
    A missive from Harbeth HQ referring to a NEW model.

    Any clues? Has Alan finally got round to designing the Harbeth turntable?
    SSFAS - Ha ha, I didn't want to seem too eager to jump on this one as I am presently giving serious consideration to replacing my wonderful P3ESR's with the M30.1 - subject to demo of course.

    However, I can tell you that it is not a turntable, nor the hoped for (by some) Harbeth amplifier as the Newsletter states it is a new speaker model. I am presuming that it will be a third model in the 40th Anniversary editions. Just for the fun of it, I am plumping for the C7 model getting pimped up - which means it will be the M30 then!!!!

    Best regards, Mike

    Comment


    • #3
      Maybe the Harbeth amplifier will finally see the light of day.

      If it's a speaker, then it would depend upon whether or not the 40th anniversary editions are considered new models.
      The US distributor has already given indication that 40th anniversary editions of the Monitor 30.1 and Compact 7ES-3 will be forthcoming.

      If it's an entirely new model, I'd be interested in a 3-way design sized and priced between the SHL5plus and the Monitor 40.2, perhaps using the two drivers from the P3ESR along with the woofer from SHL5plus.

      Comment


      • #4
        Well, there are a few possibilities, and we shall have to wait until the Munich show. The first would be a new edition of an existing model. The oldest one in the current line up is the C7 ES-3, so that would be the most plausible candidate for this option. The other two possibilities would be completely new models. One possibility would be a model to fill the price gap between between the SHL5+ and the M40.2. The other would be a dedicated centre speaker for multichannel applications. Wait and see.

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        • #5
          A successor to the C7es3? model 4 or something entirely new? The 3 is ten years old now.
          Getting to know my C7ES3

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          • #6
            There's a post from Alan from 2014 about a speaker that was supposed to be released but couldn't not be due to logistics issues. And Alan decided to redo the shl as a result . Maybe it's that one?

            maybe New model and not updated model is the clue?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by MngoMnky View Post
              There's a post from Alan from 2014 about a speaker that was supposed to be released but couldn't not be due to logistics issues. And Alan decided to redo the shl as a result . Maybe it's that one?

              maybe New model and not updated model is the clue?
              Yes, I recall that too. If that is what might be coming it will be very exciting.

              Comment


              • #8
                That project that you allude to is a massive amount of R&D work.

                I have drawn a line recently on organising my vast Research Archive in a meaningful way before undertaking huge projects like that. Sadly, the software cataloguing/jounaling pc software that I envisage just is not available quite yet (no suggestions please: I've examined over 60 now and trust me, it does not exist).

                So, somewhat reluctantly, I'm having to compromise and make-do, with the possible consequence that this task will have to be done again. I need to get the 'rule book' out of my head and into a usable procedure before I dig in any deeper.

                As an example: there are over 70 decisions that have to be made or considered before pressing the button to make a reliable frequency response measurement of a loudspeaker, one of which is precisely where to position the measurement microphone vertically.

                As an example of this documentation process, here is a snap from my journal 'things to consider when setting-up the measurement environment' (which I happend to be working on a few minutes ago). It relates to the dificulty of 'isolating' the frequency response of the speaker from the frequency response of the speaker + room. Not as trivial as it sounds. I had this process worked out some ten years ago.

                Click image for larger version

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                The point is that Harbeth speakers are not cobbled together in a farm outhouse, they're the product of a very carefully considered process. And that process and procedure takes a huge amount of attention to detail. That's the reassurance that you are paying for, and receiving.
                Alan A. Shaw
                Designer, owner
                Harbeth Audio UK

                Comment


                • #9
                  At the beginning of 2017 I made a suggestion to Alan - an SHL5+ with the tweeter and super tweeter replaced by ribbon tweeter, as an additional model alongside the current SHL5+:
                  http://www.harbeth.co.uk/usergroup/f...0153#post70153

                  As you can see no response so maybe, just maybe.........................................?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Nope. You are getting yourselves all hot and bothered unnecessarily. (Remember that Pete and Dud sketch 'Jane Russell'?)
                    Alan A. Shaw
                    Designer, owner
                    Harbeth Audio UK

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Lol! I just bought a C7-es3 last week. Just hoping it didn't get replaced so soon. :-)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Maybe it's a Harbeth floorstander again? All other possibilities have already been mentioned and all are likely to the same extent ​ I'm excited to hear the news!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          stepstomeasure.jpg Folks, this is getting silly. It's nothing radical or out of keeping with the Harbeth tradition. It's progress, not revolution, and god knows, we need more of the former and less of the latter at the moment.

                          I have had some intensive research projects underway for the last couple of years, none of which are complete and none anywhere near conclusive enough to appear in complete new-works. I am in a long period of contemplative engineering and as you well know, even squeezing an extra 5% of performance from what are, fundamentally, well designed products, is a superhuman task for a single designer working alone.

                          Indeed, as I've mentioned elsewhere, just managing the amount of data that research generates in a way that ones ageing memory can grasp, retain and cross-index is a massive task in itself. That's led me quite deep into the matter of knowledge management, a science about which I knew nothing and now have a very serious respect for.

                          I am fastidious about keeping a work journal and then routinely writing-up fair copy from it. These last few days I've been updating my "How to set up to make a frequency response measurement of a loudspeaker" self-guide which at its very simplest runs to 44 primary decision steps, although these are just the surface, obvious ones. The whys and wherefors of precisely where to position the microphone - as an example - could run to as many steps on its own.

                          The guide looks like this then .... with lots of screen snaps, photos and annotations .... It all takes time. I am not aware of any other audio designer as committed to process documentation, which may be reflected in the fact that Harbeths are consistently good, generation after generation.

                          Click image for larger version

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                          Alan A. Shaw
                          Designer, owner
                          Harbeth Audio UK

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well, at least people do care what Harbeth is producing. The conjecture has spilled over onto other forums, which to my mind is healthy. Far worse would be to announce a new product on the way and no one takes any notice.

                            I doubt very much that it will be a floor stander and what is the fascination with ribbon tweeters ? On this and other forums, ribbons are sometimes considered to be the panacea for all speaker ills, when in fact, there are good and bad ribbon drivers. Just because it's a ribbon doesn't necessarily make it any better than a moving-coil speaker.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Yes, the discussion and keeping the brand in the public's mind is wholly healthy. What worries me is when expectations run out of control, then disappointment follows. Think: Bexit, Dave!

                              One thing to consider with strip ribbon tweeters: they project sound in a vertical strip with far less sound radiated laterally. In that respect they are wholly unlike any misical instrument I can think of, so far from being a solution to natural sound, on the face of it, as a solution it is quite the opposite.
                              Alan A. Shaw
                              Designer, owner
                              Harbeth Audio UK

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