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HUG - here for all audio enthusiasts

The Harbeth User Group is the primary channel for public communication with Harbeth's HQ. If you have a 'scientific mind' and are curious about how the ear works, how it can lead us to make the right - and wrong - audio equipment decisions, and about the technical ins and outs of audio equipment, how it's designed and what choices the designer makes, then the factual Science of Audio sub-forum area of HUG is your place. The objective methods of comparing audio equipment under controlled conditions has been thoroughly examined here on HUG and elsewhere and should be accessible to non-experts and able to be tried-out at home without deep technical knowledge. From a design perspective, today's award winning Harbeths could not have been designed any other way.

Alternatively, if you just like chatting about audio and subjectivity rules for you, then the Subjective Soundings area is you. If you are quite set in your subjectivity, then HUG is likely to be a bit too fact based for you, as many of the contributors have maximised their pleasure in home music reproduction by allowing their head to rule their heart. If upon examination we think that Posts are better suited to one sub-forum than than the other, they will be redirected during Moderation, which is applied throughout the site.

Questions and Posts about, for example, 'does amplifier A sounds better than amplifier B' or 'which speaker stands or cables are best' are suitable for the Subjective Soundings area only, although HUG is really not the best place to have these sort of purely subjective airings.

The Moderators' decision is final in all matters and Harbeth does not necessarily agree with the contents of any member contributions, especially in the Subjective Soundings area, and has no control over external content.

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{Updated Oct. 2017}
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A stupid question?

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  • A stupid question?

    My SHL5 Plus speakers arrived today!

    Now - as I was preparing to open the box, I noticed a sticker On top saying "Warranty will not be valid if this sticker is disturbed".

    I cannot figure out how I can possibly open the package without tearing off the sticker. I am probably missing something glaringly obvious - can you help please?

  • #2
    Warranty sticker

    Originally posted by SChat View Post
    My SHL5 Plus speakers arrived today!

    Now - as I was preparing to open the box, I noticed a sticker On top saying "Warranty will not be valid if this sticker is disturbed".

    I cannot figure out how I can possibly open the package without tearing off the sticker. I am probably missing something glaringly obvious - can you help please?
    As you are the legitimate first and ultimate user and you have the sales documentation to prove their source, and the serial numbers etc. you are empowered to open your own speakers! I agree this is a little ambiguous and we will look at rewording it.

    We hope that you enjoy them.

    Comment


    • #3
      Redefining caution

      Originally posted by HUG-1 View Post
      As you are the legitimate first and ultimate user and you have the sales documentation to prove their source, and the serial numbers etc. you are empowered to open your own speakers! I agree this is a little ambiguous and we will look at rewording it.

      We hope that you enjoy them.
      Drafting is always tricky. I think the use of the future tense ("will not be") contributes to the ambiguity.

      I suggest something like: "Warranty may be void if this sticker is not intact." That gives the buyer/recipient fair warning, but is loose enough to, e.g., allow an authorized dealer to sell a demonstration pair and still provide the warranty.

      Comment


      • #4
        Revised wording?

        Originally posted by EricW View Post
        Drafting is always tricking. I think the use of the future tense ("will not be") contributes to the ambiguity.

        I suggest something like: "Warranty may be void if this sticker is not intact." That gives the buyer/recipient fair warning, but is loose enough to, e.g., allow an authorized dealer to sell a demonstration pair and still provide the warranty.
        I'm no lawyer but that suggestion could still cause concern amongst legitimate new owners. Why not something like "To maintain warranty this seal can only be broken by the first purchaser or an authorised Harbeth dealer." If that is the intended message, then state the message simply and clearly.

        Comment


        • #5
          Disturbed!

          Originally posted by Jeff_C View Post
          I'm no lawyer but that suggestion could still cause concern amongst legitimate new owners. Why not something like "To maintain warranty this seal can only be broken by the first purchaser or an authorised Harbeth dealer." If that is the intended message, then state the message simply and clearly.
          Precisely. To be absolutely clear though the sticker reads "Warranty will be void if this seal is disturbed".

          "Disturbed". No less. So - legally one does not even have to break it, any sign of tampering will qualify as having "Disturbed" the seal!

          All in good humour - but can cause a bit of worry

          Comment


          • #6
            Being fair

            The reason the sticker was added - years ago, this is the first time it's been commented on! - is that as an ISO9001 registered and routinely vetted company, we have to (and we're pleased to) draw a very clear line between what is our moral/legal responsibility for QC and what is over the line. The intended meaning of that sticker is, in our mind, that we absolutely guarantee that when that sticker was affixed to the sealed carton in our factory that we, Harbeth UK, take full and total responsibility for workmanship. No ifs, no buts.

            If the buyer is receiving the speakers in sealed cartons with that Warranty sticker in place, then should there be any issues (exceedingly unlikely, I can't ever recall one) I have to treat the matter very seriously, and follow a lot of internal red tape to get to the bottom of it. Conversely, if the carton has been opened, neither we here nor the buyer can vouch for what happened to the speakers after they left Harbeth UK and we do not want to be accused of diminished quality control when in fairness, the goods left us in perfect condition and are now no longer perfect. As a company we have been very lucky to have had such a great relationship with our customers, but I hear from time time of retail stories about consumer antics concerning purchased, used and returned goods which do take ones breath away for sheer bravado.

            All we are trying to do is be both responsible and fair.

            One thing that is in our view an absolute no-no, and you'd understand our position I'm sure, is that of speakers mysteriously appearing outside the Authorised channels. It would be like seeing a nice new car in an authorised main dealers, sold with warranty and after care or ostensibly the same vehicle for sale around the corner in what is clearly not an authorised location, at arms length from the maker. Perhaps it is genuine, perhaps it is not, but you wouldn't seriously expect the main dealer to enthusiastically bail out the buyer if things go wrong. There is always a back story behind why long-leadtime, in-demand, hot-selling products mysteriously appear outside the formal sales channels and there are always ways of tracing the source and it's not always an attractive one.
            Alan A. Shaw
            Designer, owner
            Harbeth Audio UK

            Comment


            • #7
              Fully understand.

              My attitude to these things are like the airlines security check. Regardless of any personal inconvenience or irritation, I would rather they were carried out as diligently and thoroughly as possible. The opposite would seriously worry me.

              Comment


              • #8
                Broken seal?

                Do not accept if seal is broken.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Opening the cartons

                  Originally posted by coredump View Post
                  Do not accept if seal is broken.
                  That's a very sensible starting point. If you are present when the seal is broken, either in the Authorised Dealer's premises or at home, that is an ideal situation.

                  It's not unusual for the customer to have travelled some distance to collect his speakers, and before he leaves the store, he wants to reassure himself that they are really in the cartons (!) and undamaged. The issue is about confidence and control. If you do not know the provenance of the speakers, beware. After all, you wouldn't view and hand over cash to a stranger for a used car in a public car park would you?
                  Alan A. Shaw
                  Designer, owner
                  Harbeth Audio UK

                  Comment

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