Announcement

Collapse

HUG - here for all audio enthusiasts

INTRODUCTION- PLEASE READ FIRST TO UNDERSTAND THIS FORUM!

"This Harbeth User Group (HUG) is the Manufacturer's own managed forum dedicated to natural sound, realisable by controlling the confounding variables between tthe microphone and the listeners' ears.

For example, the design of and interaction between the hifi amplifier and its speaker load can and potentially will alter the sound balance of what you hear. To reproduce the sounds captured by the recording microphones, as Harbeth speakers are designed to do, you would naturally select system components (sources, electronics, cables and so on) that do not color the sound before it reaches the speakers.

Identifying components for their system neutrality should, logically, start with the interpretation and analysis of their technical, objective performance, as any and every deviation from a measurably flat frequency response at any point along the serial chain from microphone to ear is very likely to cause the total system to have an audible sonic personality. That includes the contribution of the listening room itself.

HUG specialises in making complex technical matters simple to understand, aiding the identification of audio components likely to maintain a faithful relationship between the recorded sound and the sound you hear. With our heritage of natural sound, HUG cannot be really be expected to guide in the selection, approval, endorsement or even discussion of equipment that is intend to introduce a significantly personalised sound to the audio signal chain. For that you should do your own research and above all, make the effort to visit an Authorised Dealer and listen to your music at your loudness on your loudspeakers through the various electronics offered there. There is no on-line substitute for that time investment in a dealer's showroom.

If you desire to intentionally tune your system sound to your personal taste, please consider carefully how much you should rely upon the subjective opinions of strangers. Their hearing acuity and taste will be different to yours, as will be their motives and budget, their listening distance, listening loudness and listening room treatment, not necessarily leading to appropriate equipment selection and listening satisfaction for you.

Alternatively, if faithfully reproducing the sound intended by the composer, score, conductor and musicians over your speakers is your audio dream, then understanding something of the issues likely to fulfill that objective is what this forum has been helping with since 2006. Welcome!"


Jan. 2018
See more
See less

Second hand Mint C7es-2 vs New C7es-3 or M30.1 or SHL5??

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    How deep is deep?

    Originally posted by Kumar Kane View Post
    I would dump the sub. Getting sub/subs properly integrated into the main speakers, retaining coherent sound across the system, is almost never achieved. Since you have them already, you have the luxury of experimenting of course, but my choice would be to stay with 100% Harbeth sound. Work on speaker positioning and room acoustics to get the bass you want from your Harbeths.

    Good luck!
    My hope is to dump the subs... But as I've only heard the 40.1s, Im unsure as to the quality and how deep the bass can be on the SHL5s...

    Comment


    • #17
      Load?

      Originally posted by hifi_dave View Post
      You won't go wrong with the SHL5, a truly great speaker and yes, it does do well at low listening levels. That is one thing I usually demonstrate to my customers.

      Finish is a personal choice but I am very fond of Tiger Ebony, which is far darker than the Rosewood but with a similar grain patterning.
      I'm assuming that within reason they'll go loud as well?

      Comment


      • #18
        They will GO LOUD!

        They go as loud as most Hi-Fi speakers. It's a common question from potential Harbeth customers - "will they go loud ?" Well, they will and louder than some which are renowned for bass and volume, as I often demonstrate.

        You will have no worries with the SHL5.

        Comment


        • #19
          Only a Harbeth can ...

          As Dave has mentioned, the SHL-5s do go loud. However, they don't need to be played at elevated levels to come alive & detailed.

          If you are constantly exposed to live unamplified acoustic music, you'll be astounded by the way they reproduce music like ONLY a Harbeth with a RADIAL cone driver can deliver. That inherent rightness to tone, timbre & texture of instruments. Voices too, in typical Harbeth fashion, is outstanding.

          Comment


          • #20
            My Harbeth overview, model by model

            My personal take on the different models: the C7ES3 is the most intimate sounding of the three (excluding the ES2), the M30.1 the most articulate and analytical and the SHL5 has the biggest soundstage and is the most relaxed.

            The C7ES3 makes you listen to nothing but the music, but best in a smaller room, the M30.1 will have you marvel at good recordings, but will be less forgiving of bad recordings and can lose composure with listening distances much larger than 2,4 - 3,0 m and the SHL5 is the most involving in bigger rooms with it's warm balance and 'wrap around' soundfield.

            Comment


            • #21
              Succinct!

              Great to the point description as usual Garmt.
              Harbeth M30

              Comment


              • #22
                Room size and listening position

                In my opinion, room size and your listening position, 3m from the speakers, would push me toward the C7ES3, or the less expensive (out of production) ES2. The C7ES/ES2/C7ES3 were all designed in a very small room, and Alan has shared pictures on the HUG that show him in a near field position.

                While generally speaking, you can't go wrong with Harbeth, too much speaker in a small room, can overemphasize bass.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Defining nearfield

                  Originally posted by Drdennis View Post
                  In my opinion, room size and your listening position, 3m from the speakers, would push me toward the C7ES3, or the less expensive (out of production) ES2. The C7ES/ES2/C7ES3 were all designed in a very small room, and Alan has shared pictures on the HUG that show him in a near field position.

                  While generally speaking, you can't go wrong with Harbeth, too much speaker in a small room, can overemphasize bass.
                  I don't find 5x7 m particularly small and I don't consider 3 m listening distance as 'near field'. My personal recommendation would be the SHL5, if you can place them at least > 75 cm from any walls.

                  {Moderator's comment: 3m is not nearfield, it really is farfield. Nearfield means you can reach and just about touch the speakers...}

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Leaning towards ....

                    Hi All,

                    Thanks for the comments so far..

                    I couldn't believe I have sold my current speakers so quickly. they'll be gone by the weekend.. So me thinks I need to make my mine up soon. Just waiting back on a further email I sent to Andy...

                    I'm leaning towards the SHL5 (I hope it'll pay my DSOTM well )

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      SHL5 @ 2.3mtrs

                      I can only comment on the SHL5, but surely would recommend that one.
                      I use them with a distance of about 2,30 metres (just recently got nearer cause I changed the position of my sofa).

                      Now I would say that this improved the presentation even further.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Age?

                        One thing I should ask is...

                        How old is the SHL5 model?

                        Am I right in thinking that C7 has had a recent update, with the 3 monica being the version number?

                        If I buy the 5 I'll end up getting the anniversary upgrade..

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          The class-beating original C7

                          If i am not wrong, the SHL-5 is about 10 to 11 years in production since 2001/2002 thereabouts. At the moment its the only model that has not been given a facelift. But sonically its still world class & still has alot going for it. Anyway, there's a saying that goes like "why fix something when it ain't broken".

                          The current C7ES3 is the latest series since the C7 was introduced somewhere in 1994. Improvements are definitely audible but the 1st generation C7s are IMHO still better (musically) than many modern spks by a long shot.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Trapped in a technical time warp

                            Originally posted by Gan CK View Post
                            ...The current C7ES3 is the latest series since the C7 was introduced somewhere in 1994. Improvements are definitely audible but the 1st generation C7s are IMHO still better (musically) than many modern spks by a long shot.
                            Thanks for the note. The reason is that there has been no development in drive unit technology since we introduced the RADIAL coned Compact 7 nearly twenty years ago. Other speaker brands persist with using foggy, dull sounding polyproylene bass/midrange drivers hence all those fancy speakers are stuck in a 1970s time warp from which there is no escape, at any price and despite beautiful cosmetics - if you like that sort of bling.

                            "To build a better speaker first you must make a technical leap in the motor unit - specifically, the cone material used in the the driver covering the band below the tweeter..."
                            Alan A. Shaw
                            Designer, owner
                            Harbeth Audio UK

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Metal and its undampable rinnnnnnnggggging

                              Originally posted by A.S. View Post
                              Other speaker brands persist with using foggy, dull sounding polyproylene bass/midrange drivers ....
                              Except for the ones that use clear, bright metal drivers ... but those have their own problems (in my experience, a tendency to, despite being very "clean" in other areas, have a quite significant upper-midrange resonance that can severely colour voice intelligibility in particular).

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                M30.1 ideal?

                                Just a quick note if I may.

                                Three metres from the speakers, plus around half a metre behind and around them, should easily allow SHL5's I think (without seeing or "hearing" the room of course). I'm around half this distance from my main speakers and with around 30cm behind at best, for me, M30.1's would be ideal due to their tight damping and gentler subjective bass rolloff (there's still fairly deep bass, just at a lower level than in the SHL5's and no obvious port-led cutoff "corner" I feel)

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X