Announcement

Collapse

HUG - here for all audio enthusiasts

Since its inception ten years ago, the Harbeth User Group's ambition has been to create a lasting knowledge archive. Knowledge is based on facts and observations. Knowledge is timeless. Knowledge is human independent and replicatable. However, we live in new world where thanks to social media, 'facts' have become flexible and personal. HUG operates in that real world.

HUG has two approaches to contributor's Posts. If you have, like us, a scientific mind and are curious about how the ear works, how it can lead us to make the right - and wrong - decisions, and about the technical ins and outs of audio equipment, how it's designed and what choices the designer makes, then the factual area of HUG is for you. The objective methods of comparing audio equipment under controlled conditions has been thoroughly examined here on HUG and elsewhere and can be easily understood and tried with negligible technical knowledge.

Alternatively, if you just like chatting about audio and subjectivity rules for you, then the Subjective Soundings sub-forum is you. If upon examination we think that Posts are better suited to one sub-forum than than the other, they will be redirected during Moderation, which is applied throughout the site.

Questions and Posts about, for example, 'does amplifier A sounds better than amplifier B' or 'which speaker stands or cables are best' are suitable for the Subjective Soundings area.

The Moderators' decision is final in all matters regarding what appears here. That said, very few Posts are rejected. HUG Moderation individually spell and layout checks Posts for clarity but due to the workload, Posts in the Subjective Soundings area, from Oct. 2016 will not be. We regret that but we are unable to accept Posts that present what we consider to be free advertising for products that Harbeth does not make.

That's it! Enjoy!

{Updated Nov. 2016A}
See more
See less

Compact 7 ES3 with Class A Tube

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Compact 7 ES3 with Class A Tube

    Hi there,

    I am currently using my Harbeth Compact 7 ES3 with a Marantz 6003 integrated amp.
    Now I am very much interested in swapping the Marantz to a Class A Tube amp (Yaqin MS 300B, checked an revised by a professional in Germany).
    I normally listen at quiet low volume levels but I am worried if the power the Tube delivers (10 watts per channel approx.) are sufficient to drive the speakers seriously.

    Any experiences from your side would be very much appreciated.
    Best regards from Hamburg/Germany
    Oliver

  • #2
    10W of power .....

    I think that 10 watts max might be pushing your luck a bit. However, If you listen quietly and you don't play anything 'heavy', you might get away with it.

    I do occasionally, use vintage Quad II amps with just 12 watts available and for most of the time they sound great. Though you do have to be aware that cranking the volume up just that bit too much will be greeted with 'gargling' bass.

    The best advice I can give is to borrow the Yaqin for a while and see how you get on with it in your system.

    Comment


    • #3
      Cary 300 8w amp + SHL5

      I have tried the Cary 300 SEI (8 watts) with my Harbeth SHL5s and they sound very good indeed! As Dave says, so long as you keep the volume within moderate range you should quite happily be able to drive the Compact 7s with 10 watts of pure class A!
      If your amplifier has a 4/8 ohm toggle, I would put it at the 4 ohm tap! If you do a search here you will find that there are quite a few HUGGERS who drive their speakers with a 300B integrated. Monoblocks would be much better, of course!

      Comment


      • #4
        NAIM plop

        Thank you very much for for comments and input.

        While searching the "amp-market" a demoed Nait 5i/2 at an interesting price came by...at a local dealer. Fortunately I am given the possibility to test it at my home with my equipment for a number of days.

        I have now listened for a few hours and like it a lot. Now I am thinking whether the "Naim-plop" when switching it on is something I could live with...

        Comment


        • #5
          NAIM plop

          The switch on 'plop' is completely normal and won't harm your speakers.

          Comment


          • #6
            175W ss > 50W tube

            I've recently changed from a 175W solid state amp to a 50W Audio Research VS-55 tube amp. I think the C7's sound great with tubes, wonderfully expressive, vivid and 3 dimensional.

            The VS-55 is a pretty gutsy 50 watter - but I did give up some of the slam and grip of the 175W Plinius amp I was using. Personally I think 10Wpc would be pushing it with C7's.
            System Details

            Comment


            • #7
              I build tube amps and know about minimum power needed

              Ernesto-

              The Yaqin 300B SET is not nearly enough for the Compact 7 at just 10W. It might be ok, as others have said, at very low volume levels, and I mean really low. I think Harbeth recommends something around 25w minimum for the 7.

              I build single ended tube amps as a hobby. I like the 6L6 in particular, and my amps based on that tube typically put out around 9 watts per channel. I've tried them with my Compact 7s and it's just not enough.

              There are a number of decent push-pull tube amps from China that would be a better match for your Compact 7s. Jolida, for example, make several models that produce from 50-75 watts per channel.

              Like you, I would love to have a speaker that sounded as good as the Harbeth efficient enough to be used with low powered (2-9 watt) single ended tube amps. Others have asked Alan about this and it's clear that it will never happen. I think Alan or HUG-1 once described full range high efficiency speakers as a "sonic dead end".

              But the good news is that the Harbeth speakers seem to sound just as good on solid state amplification as with tube amps. I normally run my Compact 7s with a McIntosh MC275, but once I tried a Bel Canto Class D amplifier that produces 60WPC at 8 ohms. I was surprised that it sounded very good indeed. Even my 40WPC gainclone sounds very good with the Harbeths. Alan isn't kidding when he says that his speakers sound good with any competent amp. It's the truth.

              With this in mind, you may want to reconsider your motives for switching to a tube amp if the Harbeth 7 is going to be your speaker of choice. I enjoy mine with the McIntosh tube gear, but would also be satisfied with a good Class D amp from Bel Canto or Wyred 4 Sound.

              Comment


              • #8
                M30 with 15W amp at modest loudness

                I run my Monitor 30's, which are marginally less efficient than the C 7's, with a 15 WPC solid state amp, and have no problems at all-and in a fairly large space. As long as you're not into head=banging music, I think the Yaqin will be fine.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Reconsider your amplifier choices

                  Originally posted by jplaurel View Post
                  Ernesto-

                  The Yaqin 300B SET is not nearly enough for the Compact 7 at just 10W. It might be ok, as others have said, at very low volume levels, and I mean really low. I think Harbeth recommends something around 25w minimum for the 7.

                  I build single ended tube amps as a hobby. I like the 6L6 in particular, and my amps based on that tube typically put out around 9 watts per channel. I've tried them with my Compact 7s and it's just not enough.

                  There are a number of decent push-pull tube amps from China that would be a better match for your Compact 7s. Jolida, for example, make several models that produce from 50-75 watts per channel.

                  Like you, I would love to have a speaker that sounded as good as the Harbeth efficient enough to be used with low powered (2-9 watt) single ended tube amps. Others have asked Alan about this and it's clear that it will never happen. I think Alan or HUG-1 once described full range high efficiency speakers as a "sonic dead end".

                  But the good news is that the Harbeth speakers seem to sound just as good on solid state amplification as with tube amps. I normally run my Compact 7s with a McIntosh MC275, but once I tried a Bel Canto Class D amplifier that produces 60WPC at 8 ohms. I was surprised that it sounded very good indeed. Even my 40WPC gainclone sounds very good with the Harbeths. Alan isn't kidding when he says that his speakers sound good with any competent amp. It's the truth.

                  With this in mind, you may want to reconsider your motives for switching to a tube amp if the Harbeth 7 is going to be your speaker of choice. I enjoy mine with the McIntosh tube gear, but would also be satisfied with a good Class D amp from Bel Canto or Wyred 4 Sound.
                  I second that; Bel Canto & Harbeth harmonise well.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    C7ES3 with 10W amp

                    I currently driving 7ES-3s with a Shindo 10 watt SET. My room is only 12x13 and I get moderate volumes with no problem. I think its something that is doable in a small room, but pushing it. I have some more efficient field coil single driver speakers coming that will be an easier load, but I could easily live with the 7s and the 10 watt amp.

                    I'm keeping the Harbeths...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Amp Power

                      I also have a small room (12x12x9) with 7ES-3. I have used several amps, and all have been good matches. I now alternate between an LFD LE Mk IV (60 wpc), and a LEBEN CS300 XS (15 wpc). They are both wonderful, but different.

                      Other tube amps have had noticably weaker bass, but the Leben grips the woofer better than other low powered amps I've used. Waiting in the wings is a Marantz 7 and 8B that I've been fortunate to acquire. Stay tuned!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        8W with C7

                        @ernesto - It would depend on the type of music you would listen to. I use an 8-watt 300B SET with my C7s and they sound magical with string and wind instrument solos and vocals. This is not the amp if your choice of music is listening to the 1812 Overture

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Tubes OK for small-scale music

                          Magnus is right. For Jazz, and small ensemble, tube amps are great. If you are trying to fill a large space, solid state may also be a better choice, at least in terms of integrated amps. If you can only have one amp SS may be better overall, or add a really good sub.

                          {Moderator's comment: just to repeat our long standing advice ... you *need* more current than a tiny amp can deliver for anything pretending to be real-life high-fidelity reproduction. Our minimum recommendations are shown in the sales brochure. Small amps unintentionally driven too hard can fail and destroy your speakers.}

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Every amp works with C7ES3

                            I've listened to a dozen+ amplifiers connected to my C7's. I am in a small (eight person) audio group that enjoys equipment exchanging and music discusses. Not one of the amplifiers that I've heard with my C7's would not suffice with my C7's. My listening room would best be characterised as moderate size. I happen to have a LFD NCSE and it is more than fine for my needs. I don't miss the extra heat, electrical use or expense of tube rolling I had with class A tube gear in the past.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              My tube gear is more or less a decorative feature

                              I agree Pencey, I also have tube gear and I found the rolling unacceptable! The bass response on Tube amp might sound romantic with its blooming, however the bottom end response is sluggish. My tube gear is more or less a decorative feature in my listening room these days. Looks cool!

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X