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Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

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  • Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

    This thread concerns the HL-P3ES2 and the pro version, the Monitor 20 speaker.
    Last edited by A.S.; 08-08-2006, 05:43 PM.
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  • #2
    Hi,
    I own HPL3ES2 and like them very much, specially for vocal. But I fee that they little lack of "bite" in treble. Drums and cymbals have less shimer and sparkle.
    My pre and amp is Anthem tube unit, 40 W push pull. I also try them with inexpensive NAD C350 integrated and got just little bit more treble, but with price of more grain and vocal/midrange not as beatiful as tube unit.
    My room is an extension of living room with size 3M x 3.2M with no wall in one side. The speaker is in Apollo stand 25cm from the wall because of practical consideration (I have 5yr old boy). The midbass little bit too much, but I know that because of the proximity to wall.

    Any suggestion to improve the treble?

    Regards

    Comment


    • #3
      HPL3 treble

      This is strange. I have just bought some HPL3s and my immediate impression was that there is a touch too much treble, especially on LP. Friends have suggested changing from my SS amp to tubes! What a funny roundabout this game is. After a few months the treble has calmed down considerably, so it was perhaps a matter of breaking in. There's certainly a lot more treble than there was on my previous 'speakers, Martin Logan Aerius is. (The bass is much better too.) It would be interesting to hear from others what their experience has been.

      I'm delighted that Alan has started an HPL3 thread. I was beginning to think that only the BBC bought them.

      Ciao

      David




      Originally posted by adinoto
      Hi,
      I own HPL3ES2 and like them very much, specially for vocal. But I fee that they little lack of "bite" in treble. Drums and cymbals have less shimer and sparkle.
      My pre and amp is Anthem tube unit, 40 W push pull. I also try them with inexpensive NAD C350 integrated and got just little bit more treble, but with price of more grain and vocal/midrange not as beatiful as tube unit.
      My room is an extension of living room with size 3M x 3.2M with no wall in one side. The speaker is in Apollo stand 25cm from the wall because of practical consideration (I have 5yr old boy). The midbass little bit too much, but I know that because of the proximity to wall.

      Any suggestion to improve the treble?

      Regards

      Comment


      • #4
        P3 treble must be perfect then

        Taking the above two messages together confirms what the BBC have always said: ... the P3ESs treble response is absolutely 'spot on'!
        Alan A. Shaw
        Designer, owner
        Harbeth Audio UK

        Comment


        • #5
          Harbeth HL-P3ES2

          Having previously owned Von Schweikert VR-1 speakers, I thought the highs on the HL-P3ES2 speakers were very balanced. Nothing in the highs stood out and demanded attention. My only complaint with the P3's is that they seemed to sound a tad thin in the lower vocal region. In a large room setting, they tend to get lost. Although further placement experimentation might have eliminated the lower midrange / upper bass response problems, I decided to go with the C7's which I enjoy better than any previously owned speakers. However, my choice for small bookshelf monitors would definitely be for the P3's.

          Comment


          • #6
            David,

            What is your amp and source?
            Mine is Anthem tube amp 40w with EL34 PP, Rega P3 - Garrot P77 - Hagerman Bugle, and CD/SACD trough cheap Sony DVD player, currently looking for inexpensive nice dac.
            Speakers are Blutack to Apollo stand witch also blutack to wooden parquete floor.

            Regards
            adinoto

            Comment


            • #7
              amp and source

              Originally posted by adinoto
              David,

              What is your amp and source?
              Mine is Anthem tube amp 40w with EL34 PP, Rega P3 - Garrot P77 - Hagerman Bugle, and CD/SACD trough cheap Sony DVD player, currently looking for inexpensive nice dac.
              Speakers are Blutack to Apollo stand witch also blutack to wooden parquete floor.

              Regards
              adinoto
              I currently have a custom 90 watt solid-state amp that I've been happy with for over a decade. But having heard a 25-watt vintage class-A amp I'm now not so sure. Sources vary: Thorens 124 tt, with either an SME 3012 or Audioquest PT-9, with either a Dynavector DV20H or Denon 103; or a Linn LP 12 with Akito or Audioquest arm. Cd player is a Rega Planet.

              David

              Comment


              • #8
                P3ES2 / Monitor 20 at BBC News 24 (picture)

                Here is a picture of a hybrid pair. Actually it is the standard Monitor 20 grey paint cabinet with the 4 gold binding posts of the P3ES2 - sure to look much better on-screen than the Speakon plug!
                Attached Files
                Alan A. Shaw
                Designer, owner
                Harbeth Audio UK

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                  What is the difference between P3ES2 and monitor 20? Probably later I will buy shoebox speakers for vocal. Thinking about Spendor 3/5.

                  Hu

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                    The Monitor 20 is the professionalised version of the HL-P3ES2.

                    Now why, dear Lao Hu, having made an investment in Harbeth Monitor 30's, spent hundreds of hours optimising them, would you be even vaguely motivated to consider 3/5? I cannot follow your logic!
                    Alan A. Shaw
                    Designer, owner
                    Harbeth Audio UK

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                      Originally posted by A.S.
                      The Monitor 20 is the professionalised version of the HL-P3ES2.

                      Now why, dear Lao Hu, having made an investment in Harbeth Monitor 30's, spent hundreds of hours optimising them, would you be even vaguely motivated to consider 3/5? I cannot follow your logic!
                      I have two reasons:
                      1. We tried a lot of times with P3ES2 and M 30, I still think no matter how I invest in M30, they cannot broadcast human vocal as P3ES2 and 3/5 do. As I could recall, 3/5 do have their very special charming sound for vocal, and cheaper price.

                      2. When I sold my Quad 909 power amplifier, I got such inappreciable money back. If I replace my Quad 99 pre amp, I could get less money back, so why not use that for another combo?

                      Now, dear Lao Alan, do I have enough reasons?

                      Hu

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                        Originally posted by Hu
                        ... I still think no matter how I invest in M30, they cannot broadcast human vocal as P3ES2 and 3/5 do.
                        Again, not really a comment that I can follow. The P3ES is a great little speaker. The M30 (etc.) naturally have a greater scale of presentation as they are larger and they feature the RADIAL cones. It seems a little curious that you consider the entry-level Harbeth as superior to the Monitor model.

                        My input here is simply that I know from extensive off-group correspondence that there are, by your own admission, significant unresolved issues with your room and your equipment which need to be resolved first before you should consider any changes to your speakers. The M30s have been an anchor through all the trials and tribulations you have experienced.

                        I repeat again for a wider audience: First fix (or at least ameliorate) the room; then reconfirm that equipment is up to a decent standard and only then invest in the best Harbeth speakers you have the space and budget for. That's the logical, reasoned route that leads to satisfaction with the music - and the smallest long-term expenditure and least emotional trauma.
                        Alan A. Shaw
                        Designer, owner
                        Harbeth Audio UK

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Big room?

                          I am looking for Harbeth HL-P3ES2 now. But I could sure my receiver can drive them. I just bougt Outlaw RR2150. I will apprecaite if anybody could response.

                          By the way, I concern about room size also. I plan to put in the room with 15 FT X20 FTX9 FT and one side open. The most of people and dealer said these speakers are better put in small room and only a few people said that you could get good results even in the large room. One of dealer said I should but Compact 7. But my wife don't like larger speaker in room (We had one large pair already).

                          Is this true Harbeth speaker need spaces around? My family room has TV, sofa an d other. Will they affect speaker?

                          Thank you in advance.

                          John from Princeton USA

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                            John, I have had P3s for about six months in a fairly large room: 26 x 16 x 10 ft. I'm driving them with a Sugden A 51 class A amp that produces about 17 watts. They sound absolutely wonderful. They fill the room completely with their distincively musical sound, even with something like the Mahler 8 or the Verdi Requiem. They are especially lovely with chamber music and small ensemble jazz. I have them about 18" from the back wall and about 9ft from the side walls.

                            They're very nice speakers. Much better than the Martin Logans I had before. And my wife likes them too.

                            Good luck.

                            David

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Harbeth HL-P3ES2 specific

                              David,

                              Thank you for your helps. I still couldn't sure my Outlaw RR2150 can drive P3 well. The most of suggetion of amplifer for Harbeth speakers are tube amplifer from website.

                              John

                              Comment

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