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Thread: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

  1. #181
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    150

    Default Re: Naim or Sugden

    Hello Alan,

    Thank you for clarifying the speaker/amplifier interaction issue. I can - and certainly must - accept your point, that some measurable differences will occur between different amps into the same speaker. But my suspicion is that these differences are generally not audible and hence significant, though I could be proven wrong. And I am thinking of solid state, not tube amps; in terms of seeking accuracy, I tend to think solid state would be the general choice. When someone says a certain tube amp sounds particularly wonderful, I think that is probably because it'is adding something to the signal that the listener likes - or perhaps is glossing over something that he doesn't like. Not that it is more accurate than other amps. In short, the more accurate a tube amp is, the more I believe it will sound like any number of solid state amps. Again, I could be proven wrong. (And, too, the point you made must be considered; namely, that any amplifier's performance will to some extent be affected by the speaker it serves).
    My belief is that far more than electronics affecting the sound one gets from one's Harbeth's, placement in the room will affect their sound. So I would just hope that those thinking of trying different ampliifers with their Harbeth's have first taken the time to try the speakers in various configurations in the room to arrive at what seems an optimal placement. Whether this process is done using measurements or just one's ears, it should at least be a revealing one and - at best - a rewarding one.

    Ned

  2. #182
    Hu Guest

    Default Re: Naim or Sugden

    Quote Originally Posted by shseto
    i listen to jazz and classical.

    My personal expereince and feeling is that jazz and classical demand different sound. this is giving me big headache as i love both type of music.

    i like classical sounding warm and smooth with lots of air while jazz should sound exciting and dynamic.
    Yes, I think that classical and jazz demand different sound, so I understand that could be big headache even when you choose the speakers. I mostly listen to classical but I need dynamic for orchestral work. Could you try both of Sugden A21a and Naim 5?

  3. #183
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    South of England, UK
    Posts
    4,263

    Default Amps and rooms: a sense of priority

    Quote Originally Posted by Ned Mast
    My belief is that far more than electronics affecting the sound one gets from one's Harbeth's, placement in the room will affect their sound. So I would just hope that those thinking of trying different ampliifers with their Harbeth's have first taken the time to try the speakers in various configurations in the room to arrive at what seems an optimal placement.
    I agree: the commonly held belief that an amp designer (compared to what is a reality for transducer designers - microphones and speakers) has a vast bag of tricks available to somehow trash or gold plate the soundwave signals passing through his amp has always surprised me.

    Undeniably, different design strategies - even different PCB layouts - do effect sound, measurably and sonically, but compared to the almost limitless list of technical/acoustic characteristic 'distortions' that can be attributed to even good speakers, the amp designers window of improvement is small indeed.

    Domestic listening rooms make an acoustic mess of soundwaves to the point that is is nothing short of a miracle that we can hear through the peaks and troughs to be able to differentiate any detail at all. But we can. As you say, paying some attention to damping the room to kill the worst of the acoustics will reap dividends. That's where I'll be starting as I build a new listening room next month during closedown.

    Alan
    (in China)
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  4. #184
    Hu Guest

    Default Re: Naim or Sugden

    Hope we could know how to make a good listening room. I have listened to P3ES-2/Sugden A21a amp/Sugden CDP for more than two weeks. In the begining I felt that sounds brighter than my M30, slowly I got used. Now I got back to my M30/Plinius 102 power amp/Quad 99 pre amo/Quad 99CDP, I even got surprised that they sound so differently, my system sounds much more lower, smoother and softer, I even doubt they are from one family and wonder if P3ES-2 and M30 sound so differently or because of the amps?

  5. #185
    jttlee Guest

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Is Primare I20 or I30 a good match for P3ES2 or C7?

  6. #186
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    19

    Default Re: Naim or Sugden

    I purchased the Model 30 to replace 15 ohm LS3/5a's which had served me for 25 years. The amp I had used with the Rogers speakers is the NYAL Futterman OTL4. This amp worked with my Quads and the 15ohm load of the Rogers. While not the greatest bottom the Futterman is magic with the mid and high end. The magic didnot reveal itself fully until the grills came off.

  7. #187
    airdavid Guest

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    "The istant Email notification" doesn't work !!!!

    Anyway,
    does anybody listen to Monitor 30 with Exposure XXXV ?
    In Italy it's said it's a wonderful match...

    David

  8. #188
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    150

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Since I listen to CD's for the most part, I simply run my Marantz/Lavry DA10 directly into a Yamaha M65 (230 watts/channel into 4 ohms) and from there to my M40's through 10 gauge stranded copper wire.

    Ned

  9. #189
    sonofcolin Guest

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    NAIM NAC82/NAP250 with NACA5 speaker cable into compact 7ES2.

  10. #190
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    26

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    I would like to know if you can bi-amp the M40 without any external device.
    Suppose you have 2 identical mono amps powering one M40 or gain matched amps of different topology.
    One amp powers the 12" driver and the other amp powers the mid and tweeter. 2 separate speaker cables would be used along with a single jumper between the mid & tweeter.
    I may consider powering the 12" driver with a SS amp and the mid & tweeter with a tube amp.
    I would welcome Alan's comments on this. Thank you in advance for your input.

  11. #191
    Ferdinand777 Guest

    Default Jeff Rowlands for Harbeths



    I recently had the chance to try the new Jeff Rowland Model 102 digital amplifier into both the Harbeth Compact 7es2 and Monitor 30. Both speakers sound splended with this small amplifier that puts out 100w per side at 8 ohms. The Pre-amp was a tube Modwright 9.0SWL.

    Best part about the Rowland, its priced fairly at $1500 considering the build quality of the unit and the unit consumes very little electricity.


  12. #192
    hornet Guest

    Default Naim alternative

    Looking to simplify my system and want to purchase Harbeths and ss amp/pre-amp or integrated. I have read several places about the great match of Harbeth & Naim amplification, although I have not gotten to hear the combo personally. I want to simplify and do not want the hassle of din connections, extra power supplies, and expense per watt, so Naim is not really a consideration. What about some alternative ss brands which are also more affordable such as Arcam, Exposure, Rega, Densen, etc. ?

  13. #193
    sonofcolin Guest

    Default Re: Naim alternative

    All the alternatives you mention are good - but none are as good as Naim IMHO. I have owned Arcam, Rega (still do) as well as Naim. You gets what you pays for! Naim make 3 good integrated amps. You don't need to add power supplies to them, they are optional. As far as interconnects go, you can use DIN to RCA cables. Where's the hassle.

    Expense per watt? Is it possible to correlate musical pleasure to expense per watt?

  14. #194
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    93

    Default Re: Naim alternative

    Well you may want to try Lavardin. I believe they are really close in terms of sounding but I choose Lavardin because love the smooth sounding amp.

    Cheers.
    Music is not to be denied... is to be enjoyed!

  15. #195
    JLL Guest

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Hello,

    I have juste bought a pair of Monitor 30, for the moment I drive them with a A75-C75 (old branch Cambridge Audio).
    I think the bass is not well drived.
    What kind of amplifier could take the place of my Cambridge audio, with the same sound but with more bass?
    I have read that naim is suitable fot harbteh, but I doubt that naim and (old) cambrdidge audio have the same sound.
    I know that the new model, NAP 150 sound quitly different with the old 180.
    Could "you" help me?

  16. #196
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    93

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Hi JLL,
    you can try Lavardin IT integrated amp with Monitor 30.

    Lavardin IT



    Cheers.

    Quote Originally Posted by JLL
    Hello,

    I have juste bought a pair of Monitor 30, for the moment I drive them with a A75-C75 (old branch Cambridge Audio).
    I think the bass is not well drived.
    What kind of amplifier could take the place of my Cambridge audio, with the same sound but with more bass?
    I have read that naim is suitable fot harbteh, but I doubt that naim and (old) cambrdidge audio have the same sound.
    I know that the new model, NAP 150 sound quitly different with the old 180.
    Could "you" help me?
    Music is not to be denied... is to be enjoyed!

  17. #197
    Franz Guest

    Default Re: Naim alternative

    Please try also Croft GCI or Syntegra Amp. The GCI sounds full of details and fantastic if you like to hear the music not so loud - the Syntegra has the power for the full sound if the whole orchestra forces their instruments.

  18. #198
    airdavid Guest

    Default Re: Naim alternative

    Quote Originally Posted by sonofcolin
    Naim make 3 good integrated amps. You don't need to add power supplies to them, they are optional.
    3 integrated amps by Naim ?
    I know just Nait 5i, what are the others ?

    David

  19. #199
    airdavid Guest

    Default Re: Amplifier selection for your Harbeths (general, not specific Harbeth models)

    Have you tried it with Monitor 30 or just with your C-7 ?

    regards,
    David



    Quote Originally Posted by Soundbyte
    Hi JLL,
    you can try Lavardin IT integrated amp with Monitor 30.

    Lavardin IT



    Cheers.

  20. #200
    Naimeo Guest

    Default Re: Naim alternative

    I'm a ex-Naim owner with multi boxes and now driving my C7ES3 with Primare I30 - effordless power with refined liquidity that my 72/1400HC never knew...beautiful even at relatively low level.

    By the way, Rega Mira3 sounds great too. I could have happily bought it till i auditioned the I30.

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