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Thread: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

  1. #121
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    Default Re: Changes to Harbeth Monitor 40.1?

    I'm not sure what you heard but I'm seriously impressed that you can reliably hold the sound of a speaker system in your brain twelve months on! My (reliable) audio memory is about five seconds long! But thanks for the kind comments and we're pleased that you enjoyed what you heard with the M40.1.

    I can't accurately recall the history of the review pair that went to Art Dudley, but he was clearly very happy with them. I have a feeling that they were pilot production models with hand made crossovers (by me) using hand wound coils (by me) fitted (with some difficulty) on the older M40 printed circuit board. Production commenced when the custom made M40.1 pcb arrived and the small but important physical layout differences and spacing between the components (especially the coils) on the old v. new pcb had to be compensated for. If you are interested in how careful one has to be about the physical placement of inductors (chokes or coils) on the pcb look here.

    As a matter of policy, we do not like to make changes to 'flying' products. Sometimes though, suppliers unexpectedly cease trading and sometimes new materials/techniques/knowledge can be applied - and should be applied - to be sure that what leaves the factory today is the best possible manifestation of the design. But generally speaking, we really don't like to make any changes at all.
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  2. #122
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    HK
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    4

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    The M40.1 I heard 1 year ago was a far cry from the recent production.

    I wanted to feedback that this recent production is absolutely outstanding.

    It might have been changes in components supply (better quality) that gave me an unbelieveable soundstage and depth. When u hear an unbelievable soundstage u remember for a long while. (It may have been my recent listening had the M40.1 properly positioned and coned to the floor compared to previously.)

    A proper PCB design is critical and with proper mounting of coils , it would reduce the noise significantly.

    Whatever that is keep it up. The M40..1 I heard in August 08 is no way in the class of the recent production. A good feedback to Harbeth to keep the supply chain status quo.

    (Robert Green would be damned as he may not have reviewed the latest and best M40.1.)

  3. #123
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    Feb 2006
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    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Hi m30,
    May I know did you heard the latest m40.1 with totally same setup and room as you heard the early production m40.1 one year ago?

  4. #124
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    HK
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    4

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Unfortunatley it is difficult to listen to identical setup. Rooms are different, so is the cables, source , amps and stand too.

    If I were to normalize the equipment, I would say 1 year ago it had much more expensive equipment, source and amps by a factor of 3x.

    Dave Wilson would call have christen such a change like calling it - Sasha. Alan Shaw keeps it incognito. Maybe Alan should have name it after his cat - like M40.1Pussy and spin some *** appeal and sell some 15,000 speakers (M40.1) like Dave Wilson does for the Watt Puppy.

  5. #125
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    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Anyone listening to an M40.1 in August 2007 would have been listening to a prototype under development ('work in progress') as we didn't commence production until about Dec/Jan08. As I said, we really don't like to make changes to a speaker that's in production. Sales people always want the latest, newest product ready to market today so I want to be confident that we are ready.

    You will have noticed that we 'announced' the P3ESR at THE/CES Las Vegas in Jan09 and gave ourselves six months to being the speaker to market. Production commences this month.

    I must agree with you that the M40.1was definitely worth the huge mental investment that I made in the design over some years.

    P.S. Magazines have extremely long production timescales and the same knocked-about demo speakers tends to do the rounds.
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  6. #126
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Singapore
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    32

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Hi,

    Was at our local dealer's showroom yesterday, he has M40.1 setup. Goodness in no time, i was so captured, engross into music. It is indeed a fantastic speaker! Makes my C7 sounds broken

    Cheers

  7. #127
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
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    SG
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    214

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Quote Originally Posted by sunshine View Post
    Hi,

    Was at our local dealer's showroom yesterday, he has M40.1 setup. Goodness in no time, i was so captured, engross into music. It is indeed a fantastic speaker! Makes my C7 sounds broken

    Cheers
    wait no further, you should upgrade to M40.1 at once!

  8. #128
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    Default Photographs of M40.1 on Harbeth website etc.

    Surprisingly there are people who count the number of screw heads visible around Harbeth drive units and then unfortunately draw wildly erroneous conclusions.

    So, to the facts: the M40.1's Harbeth in-house made woofer needs eight screws to hold it in place on the baffle. The previous bought-in woofer used in the M40 needed only six screws. From the front, with the grille removed, if you are the sort of person who counts screws, you just might notice the difference between six and eight screws. It never crossed my mind: I'm too busy. Until you are up really close, you wouldn't notice that the woofer's cone/surround is also slightly different because we deliberately designed the M40.1's Harbeth 12" to look cosmetically similar to the original M40 woofer so as not to draw attention to the change.

    In my opinion there was no need to waste thousands of dollars on new photography with the inconvenience of taking these big heavy speakers to the photographer's studio (with risk of damage) when we can re-use the M40 photographs from our professional photo-library. And that's exactly what we've done. When we're ready, we just might arrange a photo shoot for several models to make it worthwhile. That's the explanation.
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  9. #129
    Vlado Guest

    Default Re: Photographs of M40.1 on Harbeth website etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by A.S. View Post

    Surprisingly there are people who count the number of screw heads ...........
    Its really interesting......... My only question is, when those people listen the music, whilst wasting the time with screw counting ???

  10. #130
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    I've had my Harbeth Monitor 40.1 loudspeakers now for a while, and have really been enjoying them.

    I have been having some problems with too much bass output with the majority (but not all) of electronics I have tried with them, and even with the ones that have been in the acceptable range bass balance is a wee bit more plentiful than I would like.

    I tried placing some wood disks between the speakers and my Skylan stands, and that helped with the previous electronics I was using - not perfect but better. Today out of curiosity I placed a combination of Acoustic Revive RIQ-5010 & RIQ-5010W Quartz Insulators between the speaker stands and speakers, which produced a noticeably more nicely balanced bass response, so I thought I'd pass that tip along to any other M40.1 owners that are experiencing similar issues.

    Also, if anyone has any tips to share in this department I'd love to know about them. Makes me lament the disappearance of tone controls from the world of enthusiast audio.

    Kind regards,

    Jeff

  11. #131
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    England
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    826

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Hi Jeff,
    Stands are very important with all stand mounted speakers and I have found that the best stand by far for the Harbeth range is an open frame type of stand. The heavy, solid stands do sound a bit like they look - fat and heavy.

    The stands I have settled on are from a tiny company who specialise in custom built stands, so I have bought them to match my P3's, 5's and 7's, they are working on a pair for my 40.1's which I have just ordered. The stands are from Something Solid and whilst they might not set the World alight with the aesthetics, they do the biz as far as sound is concerned and they are very reasonably priced.

    Your tip is very useful for anyone with a heavyweight stand.

  12. #132
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Quote Originally Posted by hifi_dave View Post
    Hi Jeff,
    Stands are very important with all stand mounted speakers and I have found that the best stand by far for the Harbeth range is an open frame type of stand. The heavy, solid stands do sound a bit like they look - fat and heavy.

    The stands I have settled on are from a tiny company who specialise in custom built stands, so I have bought them to match my P3's, 5's and 7's, they are working on a pair for my 40.1's which I have just ordered. The stands are from Something Solid and whilst they might not set the World alight with the aesthetics, they do the biz as far as sound is concerned and they are very reasonably priced.

    Your tip is very useful for anyone with a heavyweight stand.
    Hi Dave,

    Thanks for the tip - appreciated. When you get the stands you ordered could you post your impressions and a photo? I'd be interested in following up with Something Solid if you have an e-mail contact for them.

    Kind regards,

    Jeff

  13. #133
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
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    214

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Also note that Custom Design (UK company) makes open frame stands for Harbeth speakers, in any custom size.

  14. #134
    Ron Herbster Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Hi Jeff,
    My 40.1s are on Skylan stands and I found that by incorporating Star Sound Technologies' Audio Points, coupling disks, and micro bearing steel it firmed the bass quite nicely.
    I also found that when I switched my ics and speaker cables to Kubala Sosna Emotions it resulted in additional improvements in this area.
    If I recall I think Star Sound has a return policy so it might be worth a try.
    Hope this helps and best of luck in finding what works for you.
    Regards,
    Ron

  15. #135
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Thanks for the tips Ron!

    Best,

    Jeff

  16. #136
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default New Skylan stand 'Oreo' spacer for Harbeth Monitor 40.1

    I have found that 'hard coupling' M40.1s to Skylan stands helps to reduce the M40.1's somewhat exaggerated bass. I have been using 3 of the large Acoustic Revive quartz disks between the stands and speakers and that seems to work quite well, but that is really not a practical solution for most people due to their high cost and slippery nature.

    A couple of days ago I got a new set of prototype 'Oreo' spacers from Noel to try between the stands and M40.1s, and I have to say I like them quite a lot. They behave sonically much like the quartz disks, and maybe a bit better. Noel designed the 'Oreos' with 2 layers of hardwood top and bottom, with a layer of softer material between the hardwood layers (based on the same principle of the isolation platforms Noel makes). There is also a magnet in the spacers that holds them in place atop each of the assembly rods on each of the 4 stand pillars so they don't slip around as you position the speakers - a nice touch.

    Noel also mentioned that M40.1 users might try using the Skylan stands without filling them with sand, as sand filling tends to pronounce the bass a little bit. I haven't tried that, but intend to. Included a couple of photos so you could see what they look like when in place between the speaker and stands. Best, Jeff
    Attached Images Attached Images

  17. #137
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default Re: New Skylan stand 'Oreo' spacer for Harbeth Monitor 40.1

    Sorry, the other photos didn't load due to an 'internal server error'. I'll try again later.

  18. #138
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Has anyone tried any of the symposium products?

    I was looking at fat pads or rollerblock jr's. I was experimenting with room placement and switched cables from cardas NR to DNM speaker cable. It really helped tame the bass. Subtle but definitely better. DNM states that the increase in impedance helps control the amp. Not sure if thats the case, but I'm not changin back anytime soon.

    FYI, I'm using the sorbethane dots from sound anchor between the skylan stands and the M40.1's. I live in earthquake country so the extra bit of adhesion gives me a little confidence that the speakers will stay on the stands if we get a decent shake.

  19. #139
    Ron Herbster Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Day View Post
    I've had my Harbeth Monitor 40.1 loudspeakers now for a while, and have really been enjoying them.

    I have been having some problems with too much bass output with the majority (but not all) of electronics I have tried with them, and even with the ones that have been in the acceptable range bass balance is a wee bit more plentiful than I would like.

    I tried placing some wood disks between the speakers and my Skylan stands, and that helped with the previous electronics I was using - not perfect but better. Today out of curiosity I placed a combination of Acoustic Revive RIQ-5010 & RIQ-5010W Quartz Insulators between the speaker stands and speakers, which produced a noticeably more nicely balanced bass response, so I thought I'd pass that tip along to any other M40.1 owners that are experiencing similar issues.

    Also, if anyone has any tips to share in this department I'd love to know about them. Makes me lament the disappearance of tone controls from the world of enthusiast audio.

    Kind regards,

    Jeff
    Hi Jeff,
    I forgot to mention that you might want to consider using Cathedral Sound Room Damping Panels to alleviate your bass problem. I have found them to be very effective, easy to install, very unobtrusive and quite economical.
    They can be purchased from The Cable Company and on their web site you will find technical data and several reviews.
    I believe they currently have a sale if you purchase 4 panels.
    If you decide to give these a try, please let us know what your results were.
    Kind regards,
    Ron

  20. #140
    Jeff Day Guest

    Default Re: Harbeth Monitor 40.1 specific

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Herbster View Post
    Hi Jeff,
    I forgot to mention that you might want to consider using Cathedral Sound Room Damping Panels to alleviate your bass problem. I have found them to be very effective, easy to install, very unobtrusive and quite economical.
    They can be purchased from The Cable Company and on their web site you will find technical data and several reviews.
    I believe they currently have a sale if you purchase 4 panels.
    If you decide to give these a try, please let us know what your results were.
    Kind regards,
    Ron
    Hi Ron,

    Thanks for the suggestion - appreciated. I currently have 3 of the Acoustic Revive acoustic panels in my room, so the room is pretty well treated, and normally bass isn't an issue with the room per se.

    The problem seems to be more related to the speakers themselves, but I have had a couple of ideas on how to ameliorate the bass issues, and little by little I'm moving them the right direction.

    It is a bit of a pain to have to expend such effort to sort the bass out though, and I wish the speakers were a little more evenly balanced on the bottom. Hopefully I'll be able to get things in order, as I really like the speakers other than the bass issues, and I'd hate to think I'd have to part with them because I couldn't make the bass work acceptably in my room.

    Best,

    Jeff

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