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Thread: Coupling Harbeth to the Stand

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Athens, Greece
    Posts
    201

    Default Re: Coupling Harbeth to the Stand

    Quote Originally Posted by musicquest View Post
    Would be lovely, I'm sure....
    at least they solved Jeff Day's 40.1 dilemna.....if only I could have such a dilemna....
    Hi All,

    What about those half-ball shaped silicone pads, self adhesive but non surface spoiling, small sized, that they use to put them in/on shelf edges (you know, anti-slipping, against noise and preventing wood to wood direct contact).
    They have a very small footprint, think they wouldn't influence the sound...
    I 'm using them 3-4 years now, fitted on the 4 stand edges, not a single problem with stands' or speakers' finish.

    Cheers,
    Thanos

  2. #22
    tamule Guest

    Default

    I use Acoustech Speaker Dots on DIY stands. You could add an extra Dot at the low spot.
    enjoy,tom

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    England
    Posts
    846

    Default

    Depends on the stands. With some you need to decouple - these are usually mass loaded. With light, open frames you might need to couple, allowing energy to dissipate quickly. The Something Solid stands use carbon fibre pucks on top of the uprights for rapid dissipation away to the floor.

    Horses for courses. Just experiment but don't lose any sleep.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    England
    Posts
    94

    Default

    I have found White tack preferable to blue tack. Think it is a bit less adhesive, not just different colour. Currently using small blob of White tack on corners of stands, then a little bit of bubble wrap between tack and speaker. Seems to be a combo that works well.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    peru
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    2

    Default

    I am Lucho, from Lima, Peru. What about using brass cones for my shl5. I am thinking about it. Whar do you think ?

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Piraeus, Greece
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    46

    Default

    I use the small half-ball silicon self-adhesive pads as Thanos does. Their diameter is 0,5 cm and the speaker is like floating 2 - 3 mm over the stand. I use 3 of them in every corner (12 per speaker). The speaker is firmly attached by its weight to the stand, doesn't slip and the low frequencies are very good. Tuneful, clear and solid.

  7. #27
    ical Guest

    Default Stand insulator

    I'm using TAOC TITE-13GS between my SHL-5 and Sound Anchor stand for years. It improve on bass and detail too.

    http://www.taoc.gr.jp/insulator.html#spike

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    160

    Default Stand isolators

    Quote Originally Posted by ical View Post
    I'm using TAOC TITE-13GS between my SHL-5 and Sound Anchor stand for years. It improve on bass and detail too.

    http://www.taoc.gr.jp/insulator.html#spike
    Yes, I'm also using them on Skyland stand (old version). The insulator shown is the new version.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    350

    Default SHL5 - no need to tweak -cannot improve them

    Quote Originally Posted by hifi_dave View Post
    Just experiment but don't lose any sleep.
    For the first time in speaker ownership, since using a pair of SHL5’s, ive not bothered about tweaks and improvements, equipment, connections or having to frequently adjust tone controls or volume etc. Imo, I seriously doubt that “tweaking” Harbeths will get them to perform any better, as it appears to sound inherently “right” and that the crucial aspects of making them sound balanced, natural, fatigue free have already been addressed and ready to be appreciated straight out of the box.

    I am saying this as I have recently been toying with another pair of speakers and just cannot get them to sound right. Im getting up to position them, adjust the tone controls, the volume and am finding myself doing this for almost every different recording!

    The way the SHL5’s tolerate different volume settings, speaker placement is really quite an achievement, and don’t feel that putting something under it will take it to a whole different level.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Bad Münder, Germany
    Posts
    63

    Default The physics of the stand/speaker interface ....

    Quote Originally Posted by hifi_dave View Post
    Depends on the stands. With some you need to decouple - these are usually mass loaded. With light, open frames you might need to couple, allowing energy to dissipate quickly. The Something Solid stands use carbon fibre pucks on top of the uprights for rapid dissipation away to the floor.

    Horses for courses. Just experiment but don't lose any sleep.
    My problem with this discussion is that I don't understand which energy you are talking about. In my understanding the energy can only come from pressure or movement / friction. At the corners of a box there is almost no pressure and no movement. Ok, there may be some micro vibrations but if there are some rubber dampers or similar then this should be enought to decouple from the stands. The stands itself may be an issue. Ringing in metal stands. But this is not a problem of energy from the speakers - it's a resonance issue. I prefer DIY wooden stands. Nothing to improve in my case.

    Can you help me to understand better what to mean?

    T.W.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    England
    Posts
    846

    Default Vibrations in stands

    I'm no engineer but I understand that the movement of the speaker cone and the air within the cabinet create vibrations or energy which have to go somewhere. If it is a stand-mount speaker, some of that energy goes into the stand and thence to the floor.

    Some stands rely on mass and some on light rigidity for their performance. My findings are as above.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    902

    Default Light v. heavy stands - "all in the mind"?

    I think I started reading about this idea 10 or 15 years ago, i.e. that light but rigid speaker stands were "better" than heavy and rigid high-mass stands (usually lead or sand-filled) because the lighter stand would allow the energy to "drain" out of the speaker and would not itself "store" energy.

    I think this idea is intuitively appealing because we can form a mental picture of what the process might be. Not surprisingly, I read that people find the light stands "quick" and "lively" and "dynamic" whereas the heavier stands are "slow" "massy" "bass-heavy" and so on.

    But I really wonder if there's any rational basis for this. I don't doubt that listeners comparing the two types of stand hear a difference, or think they do, but I wonder if there would be any perceptible or meaningful difference if the visual element were removed from the equation. The fact that we can construct a mental explanation for what's happening - in this case, reinforced by a visual impression - doesn't necessarily mean that what we think is happening is actually happening.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    South of England, UK
    Posts
    4,263

    Default Stands and science

    Quote Originally Posted by EricW View Post
    I think I started reading ... that light but rigid speaker stands were "better" than heavy and rigid high-mass stands (usually lead or sand-filled) because the lighter stand would allow the energy to "drain" out of the speaker ... I think this idea is intuitively appealing because we can form a mental picture of what the process might be ...
    I wish someone would tackle this subject by measurement - that is, objectively - to reach a definitive position on the light/massive stand issue. Personally, I find it hard to believe that there is sufficient energy at the point of interface between the stand and the speaker cabinet to couple them together such that the stand can make a big difference. So what else could be happening? How about vibration not by the direct coupling to the speaker cabinet but by virtue of the sound wave from the bass/mid drive unit flowing across the surface of the stand (as it does every other object in the room) and setting-off sympathetic vibration in the stand. It's possible - especially so if the stand is tubular and not filled; the same situation as blowing across a wine bottle compared with stuffing it with some absorbent material.

    To quote what we say in the Basic Facts section:
    "7. Harbeth speakers do not need exotic stands. You can use wooden stands or metal or plastic stands. We use them all through development and critical listening. Distrust rumours that 'Harbeth's only work with 'xyz stands'. It is entirely your free choice, what takes your fancy, fits in with your furnishings and budget. If all you have available to get you going is something as basic as the IKEA plant pot stands (even used during the design of the Compact 7ES3 - see picture) or house bricks or telephone directories. The key point is to raise the tweeter to about ear level. The Skylan stands are an excellent value-for-money choice that we have used at exhibitions ourselves. Filling stands is your choice".
    I have also said that a pile of telephone directories can be used, although cosmetically and from the point of stability are a poor idea.

    Suggestion for applying some science, measurement and analysis: does anyone have an old pick-up cartridge that they'd be willing to sacrifice as a point-contact transducer? Then it would be possible to actually listen to the 'sound' of various stands. Of course, it would be essential to ensure that the same contact pressure and alignment was applied to every stand under test i.e. to remove variables associated with the measurement process itself.
    Alan A. Shaw
    Designer, owner
    Harbeth Audio UK

  14. #34
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    England
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    846

    Default Stands - I've listened to hundreds ....

    I've listened to and compared hundreds of different stands over the years to reach my own conclusions. I haven't got a scientific answer but I know what I hear and would suggest that anyone interested should try the available stands themselves.

    Alan,

    I have various 'old' cartridges sitting what do you need ?

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